Well, I ended up not playing all week. Sorry for the lack of updates,
I'll definitely get some playing in this weekend and get a game related
post up on Monday latest.
In the meantime, the poll is over, and
it seems most of you finding your way here (and bothering to vote) know
what you're getting yourselves into. A couple people seem to have
stumbled upon here by mistake, so I apologize to those if anything
misled you here.
Not much of an update, but I wanted to get a poll up for Final
Fantasy. Help me fill out my party of four by selecting your favorite
character (Fighter, Black Belt, Thief, Red Mage, White Mage, or Black
Mage). If there's an overwhelming favorite, then that character may get
multiples in the party. Hopefully there's a good mix and not everyone
picks the same character (single class parties are harder I hear). So, vote away!
A side note, I've started another blog (Side Quest Saga) dedicated to playing some
games on the side. Mainly I'll be playing games at the same
time as CRPG Addict (Chet) or The Adventure Gamer (Trickster), and what
better way to do that than also blog about it; however, there are also
some computer games I want to play that aren't on their lists. First
game up is Star Saga: One - Beyond the Boundry.
Rather than dump such out of place content here, I figured it'd be
better to separate it. There's no ordered list (although I have a short
list of games I might cover) as I'm going to leave it open for
scheduling. The console RPG blog is still my main blog though, so no
worries about it dropping off. I really just haven't had any chance to play
on my consoles.
I don't expect games to have perfect stories or interface, but there are times when certain aspects are plainly illogical or completely annoying.
Two years? Only level 1 after two years?
Phantasy
Star II began with Kyle (Rolf is the default name) reporting to his
commander for an important mission. Kyle being a level 1 Agent is given
the important assignment of discovering the origin of the strange
biomonsters roaming the land. It's a little hard to believe such an
important mission is entrusted to someone as apparently green as Kyle.
Where are all of the senior agents? If Kyle is their best at level 1,
then they're truly in a sorry state. He must have been incredibly lucky
and not fought any biomonsters during his two years.
Everyone else seems to be level one, so why is Darum so powerful?
Nei's story makes about as much sense. Her origin is a mystery, but
at some point Kyle found her and took her in. With her insisting to come, I have little choice in bringing her. North of town is a bridge where a man named Darum playing bridge troll.
With no visible law enforcement, I suppose I'll have to deal with him;
however, when I attempt to approach him I get warned that this is the
man that attacked Nei and we should avoid him. There's no other
explanation so far about Nei, but Darum is important since he's blocking
our way.
I almost called him Odin
We learn from the town of Arima that Darum has a daughter, Teim. She
was kidnapped by a gang of scoundrels (the game's name for them). At
this point I returned home to find Rudo (short for Rudolf, renamed to
Luke) waiting for me.
With his assistance manage to fully explore the nearby tower of Shure. Inside I find what Kyle
assumes (somehow) are three bodies of the scoundrels, mysteriously slain.
Did the game forget to called them biomonsters?
One had a letter
addressed to Darum for the ransom of his daughter Teim. It reads:
"'Darum! I have your daugher Teim locked in Nido tower. Pay 50,000 meseta in one month if you ever want to see her again.' To get the money, Darum turned to crime."
This letter doesn't make any sense. It was meant for Darum. It gives
the motivation for his crimes. So, shouldn't Darum have it? This still doesn't explain why Darum, a strong burly man who can steal
from anyone unmatched, is resorting to crime in order to rescue his
daughter instead of... rescuing his daughter. Also, the letter gives 1 month, but Nei was attacked 7 months ago!
With the letter in hand
Kyle muses that we should be able to convince Teim to come with us. I'm not sure how a letter showing she's being ransomed gives her a reason to escape her kidnappers, as if freedom itself wasn't enough. I found Teim in Nido where there was a definite lack of scoundrels. She was waiting patiently on the third floor in an open
area. The only locked door was right at the beginning. Why is she
here--at the farthest point from the entrance--unguarded?
Why defend her ourselves when we can pretend she's someone else?
Common sense lacking, Kyle decides he must hide Teim's identity from
people who might seek revenge against her for the actions of Darum; he
places a veil over her head. So, we bring Teim back to Darum so they can
have their happy ending. The game doesn't see it that way though, here's a video of the exchange:
What
I want to know is, where's all the money Darum's been hoarding to pay
the ransom? Based on the music, I'm guessing the game wants us to
empathize with this crazy exchange, but the moment is completely dulled
by the absurdity of the situation. Did Teim want to die? Darum can't recognize his own daughter's voice? The whole event is over so
quickly I almost missed it.
The next town is Oputa (shortened to Opta). Located
here is a musician who teaches piano. Apparently not to me though, as he's merely a sound test implemented inside the game (no bardic skills for me). Finally, I find someone that tells me where the
biosystems lab is located, in the southern part of town. Bad translation
aside, I find the lab south of the town.
I want to learn piano, not just listen to you play
Before heading out, I stock up on equipment and return home in hopes of getting a fourth member; I recruit Fera (originally
Amy). She's a doctor; it's always good to have another healer in the
group.
Figuring out equipment what I need took--and continues to take--some trial and
error. The only way to tell if a character can use something is by buying it. The same is true for comparing power levels.
Adding to the complexity is multiple weapon choices, and the possibility
of dual wielding, two-handed weapons, or shields.
Inside the biosystems lab the enemy difficulty continues to rise at a
rate where upgrading equipment is necessary to stand a chance. It feels
like I'm barely maintaining an equal footing with the enemies in each
area, and leveling up hardly makes a difference to attack and defensive powers.
On the lower floor, hazardous material will harm the party
On the very bottom floor of the lab I found the recorder inside a still active computer. Finally completing my first task I returned to the commander, who's
apparently been promoted to Mayor. The cause of the biomonsters is
determined to be a power surge in the lab. Power is being diverted from Climatrol (the weather system), causing leaps in evolution not seen
previously. Evolution makes creatures deadly and aggressive apparently.
Since my last mission was so successful, I'm sent to find the cause of
the power fluctuations. I receive a key to unlock the tunnel south of the
lab.
See, I drew a graph. Sure it doesn't line up exactly, but it's close enough
Beyond the tunnel I find Zema, a mostly uninspired town where maybe of the residents don't know what's going on. Once again I upgrade my equipment. Not 10 minutes later I find Kueri, with better upgrades that I can no longer afford.
A garbage dump is the only other location I can access. Rumors of water traveling vehicles
leads to me to believe I'll find one here; however, it turns out other
people are rummaging through the junk as well. At the bottom I find two
people discussing a jet scooter, but there's no way to ask for it. Making sure I've explored everywhere I made my
way back up wondering where to go next as I exit.
I almost left before fully exploring this part of the dump
Outside I find the jet scooter waiting for me. Turns out they've had
their fun with it, but digging through garbage is so much more
enjoyable. Therefore, I'm free to take it. Well that's nice of them.
Able to travel the seas I decide to search the overland before following my only other lead of an island that's home to a tree whose leaves allow me to breathe underwater after being turned into gum. There are colored dams, which need colored key cards to access according to
the manual. The only other location of interest is Piata. Here I find
even better armor, at a most premium price.
Damn dams blocking my passage
During my travels I managed to stop by home to welcome various
guests. Sean (Hugh) is a biologist and believes even the biomonsters
have a right to life, but doesn't regret defending humans. Cana
(Anna) is a hunter of hunters. (Where was she when we were dealing with Darum?) Meta
(Kain) is an engineer, or tried to be until he realized he destroys
every machine he touches. Shir (would have been Kili) is a thief that
steals things for fun. As an agent of the law, why don't I turn her in right away?
[Note: I say Shir would have been Kili because I had planned to name
her that; however, there's a bug in the game that doesn't allow you to
change her name. This was one of the most annoying moments I had in this
game, reloading multiple times to ensure I was selecting the correct
option. Sorry Killias, I tried.]
Except for the things you steal
It seems the last place to look is island
mountain with the tree I need to pick. It turns out the island is home
to many different trees that all look alike. I don't know which tree I
need to find, but somehow Kyle knows.
Overall the dungeons have been increasing in size and complexity,
and this mountain is yet another step up. There are caves to travel through
with no clear indication of where they exit. Luckily the tried and true
left hand rule overcomes the immensity of the mountain, and I find the
tree at last. There's no other features to the mountain, no treasure to
find, and the other trees are useless.
I can't tell if that's the sky or water
With the leaves in hand I return to Kueri, and give them to someone
that can turn them into gum. The gum, I'm guessing, will allow me to
search the bottom of the ocean. I'm not sure what for, as I'm still
looking for Climatrol, but it's my only lead.
Sorry Mario, but your princess lies in another castle
To make a long post even longer there are a few things that need some discussion to really understand some of the less obvious annoyances. First up is the cast of characters. I have a full roster now, but I've only used the first four. The main reason is that all characters are level 1.
Why would I take the time to bring
them up to an "equal" level with the rest of the group? I can't think of
anything unless I'm forced to use them at some point. The extra time to
level and cost of equipment is preventative. Currently the party is stuck with Kyle and Nei, so the choice of
one or two more members means that Kyle and Nei will always have more experience. I'm not sure there's any reason to have a hunter, thief, or biologist in the
group? The wrecker might prove helpful if I'm facing off against a lot of machinery, but techs are a pain to use in battle.
Overall, combat is pretty simple. Most of the time you'll be just
attacking. If you want to do anything else, then you're in for a
cumbersome experience. The combat menu first presents two options, Fight
and Strategy. Strategy leads to Order and Run. Order is used to assign
specific instructions to a party member: Attack, Use Tech, Use
Item, or Defend. Attack allows you to choose which group of biomonsters to
attack (default is the left one). Use Tech brings up a menu of combat
magic. Use Item gives the option to select an inventory item for that
character. Defend increases the defense of the character.
Selecting Nafoi is a short six button presses away, at least it destroys most things
Attack and Defend remain the
standing order for that character between battles. Magic and items are
one time orders, and revert to attack in subsequent turns even if defend was the prior action. As soon as fight is selected, the auto-battle takes over for each turn until a button is pressed to interrupt it. It's a
very clunky interface, and giving orders to every character each turn
takes more time than letting the auto-attack handle it in most cases.
One of the biggest annoyances outside of battle has recently been
healing after battle. With increased HP, and increasing damage per fight, healing is a real drain. To heal, I have to open the menu, select tech, select the character, select
the spell, select the character to use it on, then all the menus close.
I've been trying
to move faster while healing, which has led to another issue...
selecting the wrong spell. Both Nei and Fera have Res (basic healing) as
their first spell; Kyle has Ryuka (Return to town). Going too fast has
caused me to go back to town on more than one occasion.
Healing, only four menus to navigate
Two last pain points have to do with exploration. Instead of keeping the characters locked at the center of the screen, the party has to near the edge before the viewing area moves. I'm not sure why this decision was made, but I hope they correct it in the next game. After a battle, the screen will again be centered on the party, which is the way it should be. Adding to the fault of exploration, most dungeons have a parallax scrolling foreground that often blocks the view.
There are some good points to the game, so don't take this mostly negative post to mean I'm not enjoying it. I haven't had to go out of my way to grind, as exploring seems to have been sufficient thus far. So far, the way forward hasn't been hard to find, and I'm still anticipating the mysteries to be uncovered.
Title: Phantasy Star II Year: 1990 (1989 JP) Platform: Genesis Developer: Sega Publisher: Sega Genre: RPG Exploration - Top-down (w/ layering) Combat - Turn-based (random order)
"I had the same dream. A nightmarish vision of a giant demon and a woman warrior locked in combat. I'm but an observer to this, unable to act in any way. The horror releases a flurry of blows, and I awake with a start. I am alone in my room, the early dawn showing through the window. I'm Kyle, an agent of Paseo, capital of Mota. Shaking off the dream, I rise for the day ahead. I've been called into the commander's office to report for a special assignment first thing this morning.
Static scenes show the introduction above
The commander confides in me that he is having reservations now about the trust we've placed in the hands of Mother Brain to plan and control our future. Born of the biosystems lab, many monsters have invaded the surrounding countryside. Controlled by Mother Brain, this should never have happened, but it has. We must recover a data recorder at the lab that will tell us how the monsters were created. I say 'we' because while preparing for the journey, Nei insisted on accompanying me. I took her in some months back; I'm not really sure where she came from, but she didn't deserve the scorn and ridicule every laid on her just because she's a halfbreed of humans and the bio monsters from the lab."
*Plop*
I forgot to mention the release of the Sega Genesis back in 1989, a full two year head start on the competition, it was hoping to out do Nintendo by offering arcade ports of many popular games. It was also competing with the TurboGrafx-16 at the time, and had a price point $10 lower at release in the US. It usually takes 2 - 3 years to see anything other than ports or first-party RPGs come to console, so we'll have to wait to pass judgement on the console. I do hope it offers more than the SMS (hint, it does).
Phantasy Star II is the first RPG on the Sega Genesis (Mega Drive to the rest of the world), and a direct sequel to Phantasy Star.
Direct probably isn't the best word to use since it picks up the story
some 1000 years later after the events of the first.
The Algo (shortened
from Algol) Star System is now run by a giant computer named Mother
Brain. (With both this game and Metroid mentioning Mother Brain, I wonder if
this is a cultural reference of some kind.)
All of the planet names have been shortened as well. Alis' home planet of Palma is now Palm, the previously dry desert world of Motavia is now a lush fertile world called Mota thanks to the biolab, and finally, the icy and desolate Dezoris has become the mysterious and mostly unknown planet Dezo.
My first task was to name the lead character. Not giving it much thought, the first four letter name that came to mind was Kyle (default name is Rolf). The game offers the option of renaming each character as they join the party, except for Nei. I'm going to take full advantage of this, and name them all differently, to protect their true identity.
Before venturing too far, I explored Paseo and gathered as much information as I could from the library and townspeople. Not much was really of note, but the manual mentions any tidbit of info could prove helpful later on. I have a bad habit of not taking notes, and not mapping, especially when there's no grid. I really should correct this: map everything, note everything, and not worry about taking my time.
'Room', nice descriptive text
I noticed right away in the first combat that Nei didn't come with a weapon (actually I noticed in the equip menu, but figured she'd fight with fists... she doesn't). I'd definitely have to take care of that. Luckily Kyle had Foi, an offensive spell, that could take out an enemy with a single hit. I used this to get some extra cash (Mesetas again) to buy her a weapon. Our combined forces got us as far as the first town, Arima.
Arima had been hit hard by a band of scoundrels. Using dynamite, they blew open most of the houses, leaving them in heaps of rumble devoid of valuables. Once here, I headed back home to find Rudo (short for Rudolf) offering to join my cause. I renamed him Luke and accepted his offer.
I feel like if I ask "where is Shure?" that I'm starting a joke I don't want to get into...
The next couple hours were a blur of grinding through the first dungeon, finding the key item to get into the second dungeon, and a run in with bad luck. I realized that I hadn't saved for a good while at the exact same moment my party was wiped during the last fight before heading back to town. My save is about an hour into the evening, looking at my party, I did manage to save after purchasing a shotgun for Luke, which is where the tide in battles really started to turn. I've since learned I can dual wield hand weapons, so that's what I'll be doing for Nei and Kyle.
If you couldn't tell, my second bad habit is not saving regularly when visiting towns. Unlike the first Phantasy Star, there's no save anywhere system. Granted the port I'm playing offers save states, but I'm not going to take advantage of them. I'm forcing myself to only save in towns with the memory bank (save point). It was a hard lesson to learn, but 2 hours lost will hopefully teach me to save at every opportunity.
This seemed like a battle I could win. In two rounds I'm facing the title screen
One other change of note is the lack of first person dungeons. The technology that was so praised in Phantasy Star on the SMS was dropped for Phantasy Star II (and possibly the rest of the series). Battles are also now in a slightly third person over the shoulder perspective from the party. I'll get more into combat in a future post, but there are quite a number of changes to the system.
Even though the world seems small--and so far there's no mention of traveling between planets--I have hope things will open up. There are after all more party members that will join my merry company than can fight in the four person expedition. I can only guess they decide to move in with me because that's where party management occurs.
Session Time: 3h10m (Total Time: 3h10m)
Extra Edition:
Since having written up the above, I decided to put the time in to get back to about where I was last night. It only took an hour to make the same game progress, although I'm short a couple of levels, and some extra gold. I've had a much easier time thanks to dual wielding bars on Nei and knives on Kyle. I hope my previous encounter with the Blasters was a fluke, and I can find a way to up my defenses or something before facing them again.
I also want to mention that there was a hint book, and maps that came with the original game. It's hard to tell what originally came with the game and what didn't though from the online resources I've found, so I won't be using any maps. The fact that they call it a hint book dissuades me from using it, so I'll refrain from either resource. The manual is my only reference material.
Wonder Boy in Monster World - Rating(8 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 2 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 2 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 1 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 1 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Wonder Boy in Monster World, strangely the only Wonder Boy found on the
SeedyGamer's list, is an action platformer where precise jumping, waving
a sword, and dodging are necessary skills. It could be accurately
compared to Faxanadu, except for the one difference that drops it below
the 10 point threshold: no character development through experience or
practice. Instead, the abilities and stats are built into equipment
upgrades and life containers. It's fun being able to run and jump around
while swinging a sword, and I'd probably play the game if I could get a
compilation of Wonder Boy games, but I can't honestly include it among
other RPGs.
I believe there are also limited puzzles, quests, exploration, and
world lore built into the game. If I'm wrong on this, then it may be
enough to get it back on the list, so let me know if this isn't
completely accurate. The series lasted through a number of games, 5 - 7
at least, so if there are other Wonder Boy games I should check out,
then let me know that as well.
Golden Axe Warrior - Rating(8 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 1 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 2 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 2 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 1 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Golden Axe Warrior is yet another Zelda clone. There's a deeper story here than the first Zelda game (at least there are NPCs to talk to), but not as much inventory management due to having only a single action button. I didn't play very long, so I didn't confirm there are puzzles, but if it's anything like a Zelda game then it should.
If I've missed anything, let me know so I can add it in. For now I think I can safely say the game isn't going to reach 10 points.
It's a bit unfortunate that none of the games of the oldest consoles
provided any qualifying RPGs. Many of them had potential--combined
it would make an awesome game--yet I think it was the storage size of these
games that held them back. If you're looking for an RPG experience, you can
use the scale's rating to determine which might most appeal to you. I
tried to give more elaborate descriptions of the games towards the end for those looking
for that.
Moving on, we have come to the year 1990. Some well known games are
finally making more of an appearance. I'm sure many of you need no
introduction to at least Final Fantasy not to mention Wizardry, and we also
have three sequels (Dragon Warrior II, Phantasy Star II, and Ultima IV)
to three already well known series.
It's looking like a promising year in gaming. We've already
seen The Immortal cut a short time ago, so this is the last call to any that
wants to argue that point. I think most have voiced their opinion
though.
Here's the full list of RPGs for 1990:
Dungeon Magic: Sword of the Elements
Phantasy Star II
Little Ninja Brothers
Final Fantasy
Super Hydlide
Crystalis
Wizardry: Proving Grounds of the Mad Overlord
Destiny of an Emperor
Final Fantasy Legend
Swords and Serpents
Dragon Warrior II
Double Dungeons
Ultima IV: Quest of the Avatar
Out
of these I've played Dungeon Magic, Final Fantasy, Crystalis, Wizardry
(on PC), Final Fantasy Legend, Dragon Warrior II, and Double Dungeons.
All except for Double Dungeons was many years ago though, so I
remember next to nothing. I played Double Dungeons just last year when I
was trying to get this project going the first time, but I had neither
the same focus on the blog nor a reliance on using my own knowledge (I
used pre-made maps). This time I'll play it straight, and spend the time
to make my own maps.
I've heard that Super Hydlide can be quite the challenge. I'm
excited to play through all of these games though, even Swords and
Serpents, which has the infamous feature of needing 5 passwords
(1 for each character, and 1 for the game). I've popped in Dungeon
Magic, and found that the battery back-up save is still working. It
amazes me this battery is still be working after 22 years. Hopefully I
can say the same for the other cartridges as I get to them.
This year I have three games with a month in the release dates I couldn't find:
Dungeon Magic: Sword of the Elements
Little Ninja Brothers
Super Hydlide
To
break things up a little, and hopefully avoid two bad games in a row,
I've moved Super Hydlide to between Final Fantasy and Crystalis, and Little Ninja Brothers comes after Phantasy Star II. I know
very little of Little Ninja Brothers, but I can see it going either way.
If anyone has better release dates, I'll move the games around to fit those.
Now, on to Dungeon Magic! (After I cut a few more games...)
DragonStomper - Rating(9 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 3 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 3 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 1 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 1 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
So, I took a long hard look at the game, played it for about an hour, and have decided to call it as I see it, not an RPG. This game has a lot going for it, with many innovations for a game so early.
First and foremost, there are multiple ways to deal with the obstacles you come across. The very first being a bridge guard that asks to see your ID before he'll let you cross. Now, you could fetch the papers from the glowing castle across the map (probably the easiest to do), or you could kill the guard and walk past his rotting corpse. It's no easy task though, so you might be better off trying to bribe him instead. The only other obstacle is the dragon, which the manual suggests as having two ways to complete. Either you can stomp the dragon (kill him), or you can find a way to take his amulet, which breaks the enchantment.
In actuality, I was looking for more ways to give points to the game. Stat increases aren't permanent, and vary wildly when using items. I often wondered if all the items just reduced my dex when one finally raised it to 26. Supposedly the stats are used in combat, so I went with that as well. In the second area, the village, there are three stores that will buy and sell items. It's hard to tell what's worth it though since the manual doesn't list any of these or their uses.
The main story is there, and you get a reminder of your true purpose in town. Unfortunately, the game is so short that I don't know how much this counts. There are three screens, the first is the wilderness, and after the town we get to the dragon's cave. Actually, there's a fourth screen, which is the dragon.
The length of the game gets to me; if planned out right you could probably be beat in about 5 - 10 minutes depending on luck. In the meantime, you'll be beating your head against the wall mapping out the traps in the dragon's cave, and trying to find a way to recruit all the warriors to act as fodder. Good luck to anyone that wants to give this a try, and let me know if there's some facet of this gem I'm missing.
Randomness was getting to me, and without a strong foundation of knowledge, I don't know how anyone could get through this game. Building up that foundation requires playing through the game multiple times, and eventually going through many trial and error tests with the various items available for purchase. The amount of work involved doesn't seem worth the effort. I'd rather move on at this point and bid farewell to the past. This game came closest to meeting the criteria I set forth, so maybe it's enough for others to consider. If you're one to look at the edge cases, I strongly suggest checking this one out.
Crypts of Chaos - Rating(3 RPP)
1) 0 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 0 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 0 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 2 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
I can see why Crypts of Chaos was suggested. It offers a varied dungeon
crawling experience with multiple floors to explore. My first experience
was that the only thing I could do was go back and forth in a long
hallway fighting random monsters.
It's good to have found the instruction manual now to discover there are intersection I can turn
down, treasure to be found, and a way to escape for a high score.
Weapons have limited uses based on how powerful they are (except for the sword), and game
difficulty determines how many I get and also how deep the dungeon is. The game misses out on including character stats, levels, inventory, and a deeper world of
interaction. There's some resemblance to other first-person
RPGs that we'll see very soon.
It doesn't look like any of these older games are going to fit. If nothing else, I've enjoyed playing through these older games to see what they were like. I was hoping to play through one them for the blog, but I've found all these early games are too limited by what they can offer. I'm taking a long hard look at Dragonstomper this week. I might just play it anyway, I haven't decided yet.
Gateway to Apshai - Rating(7 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 3 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 2 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 0 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 1 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Gateway to Apshai is an interesting take on the dungeon crawler. It's an
action adventure that puts when to move on to the next floor into the
player's hand. There's a timer ticking, so you'll have to move on
eventually, but if you move too quickly, you'll find yourself over
powered quickly by powerful monsters.
This is another game that
resembles rogue-likes, but it lacks character levels. It has stats for
the character, but I never saw them go up at all; I can only imagine there are items to increase stats. Once again, the narrow
focus of the game really puts this into a hybrid that doesn't quite get
it far enough into the RPG genre for my taste. Like Tower of Doom, it's
fun and has some promise to eat away the hours, but I can't
bring myself to include it here.
The couple times I've played haven't seen me get past the second level. I suspect I was missing some of the controls, but I had a hard time hitting anything with the little sword. Also, the enemies seemed to be moving quicker than they should be, but it could have been a setting I needed to change.
Swords & Serpents - Rating(2 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 0 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 0 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 0 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Swords & Serpents (Intellivsion) has the least to do with RPGs. It
has a top down view where you explore a labrynth full of hidden
treasures. It reminds me of guantlet a bit in that you're constantly
searching for the exit while picking up items to increase your score.
Most enemies will spawn off screen and run towards you, sword extended.
You get the choice of playing as a fighter or wizard. There are no
character levels or stats, and most things only take a single hit to
die, including your character. I believe the goal is to get to the last
level and face off with a dragon, but I'm not compeltely sure about
this. Without more depth, this plays out as an arcade style action game.
Advanced Dungeons & Dragons: Cloudy Mountain CARTRIDGE - Rating(4 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement,stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 0 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 0 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 2 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Cloudy Mountain, or the original AD&D Cartridge, game seems like a
fun action-adventure. It's a little hard to tell since I seem to have
run into some sort of copy-protection. According to the manual, the
highest level of difficulty restricts starting arrows to 5 shots, and
the enemies move very quickly. I experienced a game where I began with 3
shots, and the enemies moved so quickly that I died within seconds of
seeing one. It's hard to say if this game was hacked, or I'm just having
bad luck with the controls and choosing some hidden ultra-hard mode.
Again, with no character levels or stats, no world to experience, and
little story beyond what's given in the manual, I'm left wondering how
different the RPG genre would have been if games like this stuck around
as the defining moments of early console RPGs.
Advanced Dungeons & Dragons: Treasure of Tarmin CARTRIDGE(Minotaur) - Rating(6 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 2 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 1 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 0 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 2 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Treasure of Tarmin, or Minotaur as it's called sometimes, is the second
AD&D Cartridge game for the Intellivison. TSR insisted on appending
Cartridge to the end of the titles so as not to confuse anyone buying
the game thinking it was a new pen & paper module. This one had a
lot more promise with the selection of weapons, an inventory to manage, and
spells to use in combat. It still lacks character based stats, levels,
interaction with the world outside of combat, and anything other than
the main quest. It almost has turn based battles, but it only goes as
far as having cool downs for attacks. Having the manual is necessary for playing the game.
Tower of Doom - Rating(8 RPP)
1) 4 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 2 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 2 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 0 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 0 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Tower of Doom: The game with the most promise out of all the
Intellivision games, and possibly all of the older console games, is the
first to offer character leveling and stats. However, it gets cut
because that's all it has to offer. Combat is simply bashing the enemy
with your current favorite weapon, and I easily defeated all enemies
(finally dying because I drank a freezing potion instead of a healing
one). It has the most in common with rogue-likes with random items and
maps (at least what I would guess are random). If it offered just a
little more--like turn-based combat, something more to do in combat than
just swing a sword, interesting puzzles, or a store between levels--then
it would feel more like a dungeon crawl I could call an RPG.
I'm a little sad that none of these games made the cut, and I
considered playing through Tower of Doom. I was stuck in deciding what
scenario to playthrough and consider the game beaten. Any one of them
would probably only take an hour, so I'd have to play the game as a
whole I think. If someone wants to convince me to try it out, feel free.
For those interested, all of these games are available through
either Intellivision Lives! (Both AD&D games + Tower of Doom) or
Intellivision Rocks! (Swords & Serpents). Tower of Doom is available
through the Game Room on Xbox Live. If an arbitrary number of people come
along that want to see Tower of Doom, then I'll probably play it on the
Xbox 360.
StarTropics - Rating(7 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 2 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 2 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 0 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 1 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
StarTropics is another game I remember fondly. One of the most
innovative puzzles in the game broke the fourth wall, and was nearly
unsolvable for us because we rented the game. Packaged with the game was
a letter written to the main character from his grandpa. The puzzle
involves using this letter to obtain a password.
Now I can't remember if we used Nintendo Power, or if we brute
forced the four digit passcode. At some point I hope to replay this
game, and get through the sequel as well, which I've never had a chance
to play. Sadly, this series is below the criteria I'm seeking to
establish games as RPGs.
It's a fun action adventure, one of the best on the NES, but it's
limited by having chapters instead of an open world, no leveling, and no
character attributes or skill increases. It has quite a bit going for
it with NPCs that fill out the world, a main quest that's engaging with
twists and turns, and some exploration of the caves in each level. There
are a few puzzles, but they all tie into the main quest. It's close,
but like most of the Zelda games, we're left with a different
experience.
Zoda's Revenge: StarTropics II - Rating(7 RPP)
1) 1 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 2 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 2 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 0 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 1 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
From the videos I've seen, this is an expanded version of the first game. Both games have chapters and dungeons that don't allow any backtracking. I'm not aware of any side quests, and the NPCs are talkative, but I don't remember them providing much of a purpose other than giving weapons and items. I believe this one is a bit longer, and I haven't played it myself, so I could be wrong that it doesn't offer anything different.
Secret Quest - Rating(0 RPP)
1) 0 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 0 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 0 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 0 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 0 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 0 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Secret Quest for the Atari 2600 is the one with the newest release date
I've added to the list at the suggestion of AmyK, so I thought I'd take a look at it first. After playing it
though, I'm convinced it doesn't fit my criteria. From the description,
the game has 8 levels of increasing maze-like difficulty where you need
to set a self-destruct mechanism and reach the exit before it blows.
Your character is given a light sword, which uses a small amount of
energy and has a limited oxygen supply that acts as health, but both
also drain slowly on their own. There doesn't seem to be much beyond
this though, and it's lacking a fleshed out character (stats and
skills), combat is basic (collide sword with enemy), and there's no
other NPC, story, or quest interaction to be had. To classify it, it's
an arcade style action game much like many other Atari 2600 games.
Many other of the older games aren't quite fitting either, so to
save from flooding everyone with posts I'll start combining a few of the
more alike games. Hopefully this won't be too confusing for anyone
trying to follow along.
Sorry AmyK, I hope your other suggestions pan out a bit better.
Shadowgate - Rating(8 RPP)
1) 0 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 1 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 3 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 1 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 1 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
This is one of my favorite adventure games, mainly because it's the first one I beat on my own I believe. I can't really remember why I was so drawn in. I've planned out a speedrun for the game, and helped push the TAS to a level where it's beaten in less than 8 minutes. A TAS differs from a speedrun by using an emulator as a computer assisted tool to play the game. It's all in good fun, and if you have the time, I suggest checking it out at tasvideos.org. Once I get around to a speedrun it'll be close to 14 minutes.
Déjà Vu - Rating(8 RPP)
1) 0 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 1 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 3 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 1 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 1 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
The second Macventure game to make it to the NES. I didn't get into it as much. Mostly because I seemed to randomly die. We only rented this one, so I didn't get the chance to put hours into figuring it out. One of the main reasons I played the game was the character on the cover looked like Dick Tracy. I wonder how intentional that was.
Uninvited - Rating(8 RPP)
1) 0 - Character Advancement: practice/experience based advancement, stat or level
increases, multiple classes or
characters, customize characters
2) 1 - Combat: character stats used for combat, additional combat options, turn based
3) 1 - Items and Equipment: store to buy and sell, equipment decisions, item decisions
4) 3 - Story: main story at the forefront; world full of hints and lore; descriptions for objects, people, and places
5) 1 - Exploration: open world from the beginning, visited locations remain open
6) 1 - Quests and Puzzles: side quests not related to the main quest, puzzles and riddles to solve
Everything about the atmosphere in Uninvited drew me in, much like Shadowgate. Yet, I never got into this game as much due to an item that causes death some number of actions later. I never really understood this, so I'd create new games and end up saving after getting the item. It's hard to discover this feature of the game, and I continued to be discouraged when I reached a game over screen for no reason.
I questioned the usefulness of SeedyGamer's list when I saw the
MacVenture games in it. I imagine he's using a definition for the term
'RPG' as broad as that used for role-playing games in real life. Having
such a all encompassing definition isn't useful for me when I'm trying to talk
about the games I enjoy. My hope is that many of the games that are
obviously not RPGs to me will provide good counter-examples.
Shadowgate, Deja Vu, and Uninvited are adventure games. I'm curious
why these adventure games made SeedyGamer's list, but Maniac Mansion
didn't. In any case, all of these games scored below the requisite
10 points due to lack of character progression, economy, stifled
exploration, and a linear quest. I'm combining these all into one post
based on how similar adventure games are, and not to create a flood of
posts where I'd have to repeat myself.
Here's why I think adventure games aren't RPGs:
Adventure
games have the focus on progressing via object based puzzles. The
challenge is in figuring which specifically designed item to use to
overcome a certain obstacle. It could be as simple as putting a gem in a
slot, speaking the right spell at the right time, or selecting the
correct dialogue option. Usually the game consists of a series of these
until the game ends. RPGs do include these sorts of lock & key
puzzles, usually calling them quests, but the majority of the time the
challenge is in obtaining the item rather than figuring out which item
to use.
The main thing adventure games lack is character progression. RPGs
provide a means to improve the character's stats, skills, and/or
abilities. This puts the emphasis of mastery on the character rather
than the player. The knowledge of what actions would work best in a
given situation is in the player's hands; however, the likelihood of
success rests in the character's ability to perform those actions.
Hopefully these two general points are enough to divide the genres
in a consistent way. We'll see if any other adventure games find their
way on to the list. On to more promising games.
Edit: If you're interested in knowing more about these games, do check out the Adventure Gamer's playthroughs on the DOS versions of Shadowgate, Uninvited, and Déjà Vu. The NES versions were a bit easier on the eyes and ears, and the interface was streamlined I think. In most other ways the games are nearly identical.
Combatant
Combat is very basic. It always comes down to an equal exchange of blows. Both sides have a chance to dodge attacks, but there aren't any spells to enhance combat. Items take the place of spells, but they're limited to damage, silencing enemies, and healing. It's easy to know if you'll win or lose after the first hits.
Enemies are definitely challenging, and sometimes overly so. The ones that can sleep-lock the party are just plain unfair. Using stones to silence them isn't guaranteed, and the cost doesn't balance out. The final battle in particular demands a lot of preparation and planning to win if you haven't gained extra levels.
Gaining levels do give a small bonus to attack and defense, and more importantly a bump in HP. The difference between levels isn't very noticeable though, and you may not notice the increase in damage. Each level becomes longer and longer because gaining experience is based on either damage inflicted or a set amount each hit, and has little to do with the enemy you're fighting. In other words, you always gain the same amount of experience throughout the entire game. Having only one character able to gain experience from attacking each turn slows things down to a crawl.
All of the enemies are unique to this game, and I don't think I saw anything resembling a goblin or orc. It's interesting to note that this and Phantasy Star maintained a unique set of enemies that are refreshing even after playing through multiple RPGs. Rewards for each enemy is all over the place, one will give 300 Guilders while another in same area gives 2,000. Later on, the enemies in dungeons only give a small number of fangs. Rating: 4
Items from battle are rare; rarer still is the game telling the truth. The potion heals, it doesn't resurrect.
Admirer
I really don't expect much from older games, so I hope everyone understands this section is going to be very low for the majority of games over the next few years. Experience is gained by each hit landed, and gaining enough experience raises a character's HP, attack, defense, and the amount of exp. necessary for the next level.
Individual spells don't exist. In fact, spells are only used to unlock certain areas, or to recruit the companions. Nothing about the companions is customizable, but you do get to pick the name of the main character. There's no equipment options, and the experience will be the same for all players. Controls are good enough, although they seemed to stick some times. This may have been due to using an emulator, so I'm not going to knock it for that. With the lack of pretty much all options, this area is the weakest for the game. Rating: 2
At least there are a couple of screens to check out the characters
Puzzler
The main quest is the only quest available here. It stays in clear view, and the next step is usually hinted at by the random travelers and merchants the party can talk to just in case it's been a while since you received the actual directions (which aren't usually repeated). There are a couple of treasures on the side, but I wouldn't really call them side quests.
The only riddle I can come up with is the scroll that gives directions to the final dungeon. It was a bit unclear where to start, but really it only makes sense that it was on the final continent. Any other place for the final dungeon would open up the possibility of early discovery. Rating: 3
I think this is the only puzzle in the game
Instigator
One thing that made the above puzzle so difficult was the lack of location information. I found out that Medi's town (home town?) was where I needed to start from, but I found no dots to connect between this clue and the actual town I needed to start from. In every other case, the hints from the random NPCs and towns were enough to lead me in the right direction.
The story maintained the same straightforward story about getting to the seal of the dark lord. There aren't any twists to this plot and no way to influence the story. Rating: 3
The elders of each town will only talk to you if you donate some money to the town
Collector
There are a couple of optional items that make the game a bit easier. One is the mask that illuminates the dungeons 1 square. There's also a helm that allows the party to see messages on the walls of the dungeon. Only two messages exist, one shows a hidden crystal that increases the visible area once again. Also, there's a mantle that's supposed to reduce encounters with weaker enemies, but it only works on enemies that I'd never see anyway unless I visited the first continent.
The inventory fills up well enough, although there is room for more. By the end of the game it's pretty obvious there isn't anything more to find, which is nice for a sense of completion. The economy is a little bloated, although I still felt there I could run out of money if I wasn't careful about my purchases and picking the most rewarding fights. Rating: 5
My inventory before completing the game
Explorer
The graphics are better than anything I remember seeing on the NES, so it's sad there weren't more RPGs on the SMS. Music is catchy, and sound effects are fitting. The dungeon music was actually a bit familiar. If anyone has heard this before and could place it in another game I'd appreciate it.
Exploring the world map is interesting, and finding the various locations is rewarding. Especially when those locations aren't mentioned in anyway. It doesn't happen enough for my taste though, and the viewing window is a 5x5 tile, which is extremely restrictive. The huge portion of the view that shows the party seems like it'd better be used to show more of the world. It would be nice to have some more variety in dungeons and towns. Rating: 3
One of the hidden squares; the only obvious ones
Final Rating: 20 (33%)
As an early RPG, it stands up well as a game, although it's rather shallow in comparison. I enjoyed it, but it's not going to make any list of games to play again. I wouldn't really recommend the game to anyone, there are better ways to spend your time. It was good for the time, but even Phantasy Star is better.
Next up are some even older games, but first I'll be cutting a few from the list.
